Press conference
3.4
Together with the upcoming updates we want to plan and eventually fix one flaw of the game.
Currently all TOP level teams do not train free throws skill. Average free-throw skill in the first league for players above 300RT is only 4.5
Even the best snipers in the game have very bad free-throw skill.
Now I am projecting players' types for scouts/drafts features and the community asked to create a “max skill” limit for free-throw skill.
I discussed this topic with Ramune and we decided that it is better to fix this illogical place than make all future Drafts players with very low free throw skill.
We understand that such updates should be done very slowly. Teams should have enough time to adjust. So from the 77th season we will start to gradually:
1. Reduce experience impact for shooting free-throws
2. Reduce the lowest percentage of free-throw shooting
3. Increase max percentage for free-throw shooting
4. Reduce free-throw skill effectiveness based on the average RT of the match. This probably should be more “experience” area than “free throw” skill, but we need to have this otherwise free-throw percentage in small leagues would be always illogically bad.
This update will be made in very small steps every season. We plan to finish this update only in the 87th season.
We will remind the community about this update every season in the season's news.
Currently all TOP level teams do not train free throws skill. Average free-throw skill in the first league for players above 300RT is only 4.5
Even the best snipers in the game have very bad free-throw skill.
Now I am projecting players' types for scouts/drafts features and the community asked to create a “max skill” limit for free-throw skill.
I discussed this topic with Ramune and we decided that it is better to fix this illogical place than make all future Drafts players with very low free throw skill.
We understand that such updates should be done very slowly. Teams should have enough time to adjust. So from the 77th season we will start to gradually:
1. Reduce experience impact for shooting free-throws
2. Reduce the lowest percentage of free-throw shooting
3. Increase max percentage for free-throw shooting
4. Reduce free-throw skill effectiveness based on the average RT of the match. This probably should be more “experience” area than “free throw” skill, but we need to have this otherwise free-throw percentage in small leagues would be always illogically bad.
This update will be made in very small steps every season. We plan to finish this update only in the 87th season.
We will remind the community about this update every season in the season's news.
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+5
Can you please explain #4. Yha ks!
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75 S
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+1
*Thanks
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+0
Let's imagine that average free throw skill in TOP league goes from 4.5 to 7.5. Meanwhile the average skill in the weakest leagues will still be 4-5.
However the average free throw percentage even in weak leagues should not be 40%.
So in TOP level matches (in order to have the same free-throws percentage) players will need to have bigger free-throw skill compared to low level matches.
Probably we will just increase/decrease free-throw skill in the match engine based on average match RT. -- 75 S 48 d.
However the average free throw percentage even in weak leagues should not be 40%.
So in TOP level matches (in order to have the same free-throws percentage) players will need to have bigger free-throw skill compared to low level matches.
Probably we will just increase/decrease free-throw skill in the match engine based on average match RT. -- 75 S 48 d.
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+1
I am afraid, that after such update the game strategies will go totally the other way.
As we have a lot of close games, seems like in far future making fouls when you are behind will be as advantage. Also the game will become 3pt shooting exibition. -- 75 S 48 d.
As we have a lot of close games, seems like in far future making fouls when you are behind will be as advantage. Also the game will become 3pt shooting exibition. -- 75 S 48 d.
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+1
Tai gal prie to pačio padarykit, kad treniruojant tritaškį arba vidutinius, tai ir baudos autmatiškai kažkiek didėtų? Ar tai nebūtų logiška?
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+4
darys:Gal ir būtų logiška, bet dabartinėje treniruočių sistemoje gana sudėtinga tai padaryti. -- 75 S 48 d.
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+1
Great idea, however I don't think it will really fix the "issue". The reason that this started was because of the extremely high inners for accuracy players. Making their free throw shooting more important won't give them much more value at all as players. When players are set as a shooter, they shoot hardly any free throws at all anyways. So it is still a bit of a waste. Just looking quickly at my player stats, I have a player that has been set as a shooter for 469 minutes and over this course of time this season he has shot 6 free throws. The high inners for "shooters" will still be a waste. It will only be useful for "non-shooters" that don't have the higher inners. It also doesn't help address the problem of "shooters" frequently being very slow.
It makes sense that free throws has something to do with mid-range/three point shooting as Darys prescribed.
and addressing illogical situations, it would not make logical sense to have a player shoot free throws at 78% in WL5, then 71% in WL4, 64% in WL3 and then 56% in WL2
This is what would happen if the skill wasn't trained. To counter this, a manager would then have to train free throws every season? -- 75 S 49 d.
It makes sense that free throws has something to do with mid-range/three point shooting as Darys prescribed.
and addressing illogical situations, it would not make logical sense to have a player shoot free throws at 78% in WL5, then 71% in WL4, 64% in WL3 and then 56% in WL2
This is what would happen if the skill wasn't trained. To counter this, a manager would then have to train free throws every season? -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
There is a chance to give a high specific value to experience when playing in higher leagues and continuous disminut this value(ratio) when in lower leagues ?
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75 S
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+1
Nevermind, it was already discussed
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75 S
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+1
I like that you are going to finish changes in 87th season. That's good condition.
I am neutral about this update. -- 75 S 49 d.
I am neutral about this update. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
Free throw skill should be based 90% on FT trained skill if such a category exists. I would prefer the mid range skill be used and eliminate the FT skill entirely. Why is Accuracy the only skill with 4 areas to train? Experience in free throws can only be considered as having more training in them, which is not right to give this to players.
Also, there should be marked differences in FT percentages in different WL's since a 4 FT skill should give about a very low chance to make a FT shot. To artificially mark the chance up is part of the problem and why it is not trained. -- 75 S 49 d.
Also, there should be marked differences in FT percentages in different WL's since a 4 FT skill should give about a very low chance to make a FT shot. To artificially mark the chance up is part of the problem and why it is not trained. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+3
I like his idea. I have another one - free throws don't have inner potential - it uses mid range potential.
Also I hope that 4 free throws skilled 10exp player in 1st WL will have at least 50% average.
Another problem - initial fouls against worst free shooter in game engine. It's very hard to get a foul in a real world agains worst shooter. -- 75 S 49 d.
Also I hope that 4 free throws skilled 10exp player in 1st WL will have at least 50% average.
Another problem - initial fouls against worst free shooter in game engine. It's very hard to get a foul in a real world agains worst shooter. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
Viena kvailiausių žaidimo vietų. Snaiperių prikimštos komandos. O baudos pas visus 4-5 jei anksti paskautintas. Absurdas. Jei lesa tritaškius tai dažniausiai tokie žaidėjai ir baudas sumeta. Realybėje dabar ant staigiųjų įvardint galiu 2 žaidėjus , kurie trajakus neblogai metė, o baudas prastai. Tai Baron Davis ir Jason Richardson.
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+1
Totaly agree with darys. If you can't do what is logical and acceptable for all, maybe it is better to do nothing with it
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+1
Doing nothing and leaving this skill in the same condition for another 50th season is not an option.
I probably would like to remove it completely, but that is quite a big update and I don't see any possibility to work with it now neither in the future. -- 75 S 49 d.
I probably would like to remove it completely, but that is quite a big update and I don't see any possibility to work with it now neither in the future. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+3
Ok guys, after examining possibilities and how much time it would take, we should probably take a bit different way. Here is a new plan ;)
In the end of 79th season:
1. We will remove free-throw shooting skill
2. Training points from free-throw skill will be added to middle range skill
3. In the match engine instead of free throw skill we will use middle range skill.
We will need to adjust many parts of the game but it is better to fix this once and for all than to have the same discussion after a few seasons. -- 75 S 49 d.
In the end of 79th season:
1. We will remove free-throw shooting skill
2. Training points from free-throw skill will be added to middle range skill
3. In the match engine instead of free throw skill we will use middle range skill.
We will need to adjust many parts of the game but it is better to fix this once and for all than to have the same discussion after a few seasons. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+12
1.1
Every player who can shot a free throw in the backyard can get it in a Euroleague match too. I would connect his ability to make point from the line to his value in his free shot skill.
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+1
Also the inner potential of middle range shooting will be recalculated (combined from free-throw skill potential and middle-level potential).
After free-throw skill removal total sum of inner potentials should still be the same as it is now (0) -- 75 S 49 d.
After free-throw skill removal total sum of inner potentials should still be the same as it is now (0) -- 75 S 49 d.
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+2
Sounds fine, buy one question
What about the players that have had their free throw skill trained? I hope that they don't just lose the training that was done there altogether. -- 75 S 49 d.
What about the players that have had their free throw skill trained? I hope that they don't just lose the training that was done there altogether. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
2. Training points from free-throw skill will be added to middle range skill
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+1
Well what about the players that have a 12 skill in mid range already? These points even with 7 skill in free throws have no chance to have any affect at all.
Also shooters - most have over 50% inner in mid range and free throws, does this mean they will have over 100%. I know of a player with +95 mid range and +80 free.thrwos for example. -- 75 S 49 d.
Also shooters - most have over 50% inner in mid range and free throws, does this mean they will have over 100%. I know of a player with +95 mid range and +80 free.thrwos for example. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
In any update, there are some issues that cannot be solved. In this case I think that only a few players would be affected in a negative way, so I think this update would be grate for the game.
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+4
Total sum of potentials has to remain 0.
In cases when free-throw and middle-range inner potentials’ sum is bigger than 100 (or less than -90) we will add the remaining potential points to another skill (probably just randomly)
If player's middle range shooting is 12 now, it will be 12 + free throw points. We will not make the possibility to choose where free-throw points should be transfered.
This update is already quite big and “expensive”. We need to try reducing its complexity, not increasing it.
As this update will be included only after a few seasons, users have a lot of time to adjust their rosters and training. -- 75 S 49 d.
In cases when free-throw and middle-range inner potentials’ sum is bigger than 100 (or less than -90) we will add the remaining potential points to another skill (probably just randomly)
If player's middle range shooting is 12 now, it will be 12 + free throw points. We will not make the possibility to choose where free-throw points should be transfered.
This update is already quite big and “expensive”. We need to try reducing its complexity, not increasing it.
As this update will be included only after a few seasons, users have a lot of time to adjust their rosters and training. -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
So in game engine it would be only one change - 2M instead of FT? How about reducing exp impact, lowest percentage and increasing max percentage for FT?
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+1
Xp should matter on free throws (pressure situations)
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+1
This will hurt more than a couple of my players, but in support of the change.
Info have a couple questions on the process.
When removing training points from the free throw skill, will you do a simple subtraction, or will you apply the inners that were applied to that skill before taking them out?
When you add in the free throw training, will you recalculate this skill based on the new inner that the mid range has?
For example, a player with 1000 points on mid range today with an inner of zero. Free throws add in another 1000 and the inner on the free throws was +20, so now 2000 total training points. Would this now become 2400, or just 2000? -- 75 S 49 d.
Info have a couple questions on the process.
When removing training points from the free throw skill, will you do a simple subtraction, or will you apply the inners that were applied to that skill before taking them out?
When you add in the free throw training, will you recalculate this skill based on the new inner that the mid range has?
For example, a player with 1000 points on mid range today with an inner of zero. Free throws add in another 1000 and the inner on the free throws was +20, so now 2000 total training points. Would this now become 2400, or just 2000? -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
First sentence was supposed to be
*I have a couple (for whatever reason auto-correct put the word info there). -- 75 S 49 d.
*I have a couple (for whatever reason auto-correct put the word info there). -- 75 S 49 d.
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+1
evinelis: In match engine we will only change from free-throws skill to middle-range skill.
TheCoach:We will just add free throw points to middle-range points without looking into potentials. Otherwise players RT can change drastically.
So in your example it will be 2000 points -- 75 S 49 d.
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+4
Thanks a-darius, a smart decision!
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+3
Crazy how things change. We went (when I started) from (FT 2c and 3pt) to (FT 2C 2M and 3pt) and now (2C 2M and 3pt). Every step has been a positive in my eyes
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+1
I see 2 good things in this update:
- training regains its symmetry, which is always nice
- 2point-Medium may reach the same level of usefulness as other shot choices.
Both 1point and 2Medium were not trained because there are not enough shot opportunities to justify the investment in training points.
Merged into 1 it may be worth the bother -- 75 S 50 d.
- training regains its symmetry, which is always nice
- 2point-Medium may reach the same level of usefulness as other shot choices.
Both 1point and 2Medium were not trained because there are not enough shot opportunities to justify the investment in training points.
Merged into 1 it may be worth the bother -- 75 S 50 d.
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+1
Can you explain a little bit better how you would determine excess points? So say your player is already a 12 in mid range and he is getting 450 points from FT. Would he become a 13? If not what is the cut off etc? I think you said 90% but these things matter when training so I just wanted to understand the details.
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+1
No Bloomis. You are putting two things into one. They are separate, one is talking about training points the other about inner potential.
If your player has 12 skill in mid range then the 450 points of training would then get put in the mid range skill. He would still be 12, just 450 points towards the 2000 needed for a 13 skill.
When he discussed %, he was talking about inner potentials. If the free throw inner and the mid range inner are above 100% then the % above 100 would be randomly distributed in other skills. For example a player with +80 free throws and +95 mid range you cannot make the mid range +175 inner so the extra 75 will be randomly added onto the other skills.
If the Free throw is -50 and the mid range was -50 then -90 would be the inner for the mid range and the other -10 would randomly be placed on other skills so that the inner potentials still add up to zero. -- 75 S 50 d.
If your player has 12 skill in mid range then the 450 points of training would then get put in the mid range skill. He would still be 12, just 450 points towards the 2000 needed for a 13 skill.
When he discussed %, he was talking about inner potentials. If the free throw inner and the mid range inner are above 100% then the % above 100 would be randomly distributed in other skills. For example a player with +80 free throws and +95 mid range you cannot make the mid range +175 inner so the extra 75 will be randomly added onto the other skills.
If the Free throw is -50 and the mid range was -50 then -90 would be the inner for the mid range and the other -10 would randomly be placed on other skills so that the inner potentials still add up to zero. -- 75 S 50 d.
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+1
gotcha, thanks.
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+1
last question, when you know the answer, to help in preparation for this update, can you give a range of the expected free throw % for each skill in free throws?
Since this is new, I would hate to over train or under train what I would want here and would prefer not to have to guess, thanks. -- 75 S 50 d.
Since this is new, I would hate to over train or under train what I would want here and would prefer not to have to guess, thanks. -- 75 S 50 d.
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+1
I totally approve of this change ;)
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+1
1.1
So what will happen, will they be simply added? (e.g. 6 ft + 1 tm - > will become a 7 tm?
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+1
Training points, not skill points
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+1
Would end up a 6 or possibly a 7 depending on how many extra you have in midrange + extra in free throws
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+1
Example, you have 6 skill in mid range with 25 points over what was needed to have a 6 skill. The mid range skill is 1 but with 40 points toward a having a 2 skill. Now your player would be a 6 in mid range and have 65 points toward a 7 skill in mid range.
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+1
So if ft and mid inners wil be over 100%, and will be added to the random skill, we gonna analyze our youngsters again, to see where they go?
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+1
And how the % will be distributed is one of key aspects - everybody has young players for which they plan trainings in advance, so it would be good to have a plan for them.
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+1
I can not think of a reason to delay this update and spread over 10 seasons. Make the change and be done with it.
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+1
benislovas: We don`t know yet. Now we are focused on other updates.
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+1
Darius - you can keep focused. It is just a matter of decision.
I see few options:
1. Distribute evenly on all other skills.
2. Put on 1 or 2 biggest negatives evenly
3. Let owner of the player to decide
I am sure that I am not the only one with such problem. Without such info I am left in the dark which path to choose for developing my player. -- 77 S 62 d.
I see few options:
1. Distribute evenly on all other skills.
2. Put on 1 or 2 biggest negatives evenly
3. Let owner of the player to decide
I am sure that I am not the only one with such problem. Without such info I am left in the dark which path to choose for developing my player. -- 77 S 62 d.
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+2
I think option No. 1 sounds most logical, and option No. 3 would be an awful decision.
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+1
For me options 2-3 are more logical, but everyone has his opinion about it.
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+1
